In this episode Zeke discusses the current state of technology and how it affects us today with his friend Hamed (@chef.ockmed).
Audio
Powered by RedCircle
YouTube Clip
YouTube Video
Transcript
[Music]
Zeke: This week Episode Five was kinda long, so I decided to turn into two. You’ll currently listen to Episode 5.1 Technology Today, where me and Hamed will talk about technology. You can listen to the rest of the episode in Episode 5.2 Nerds and Anime which will premiere on February 28. This Friday, around 1 pm. Now let’s get back to the regular show.
Zeke: I like to welcome everyone to another episode of the Let’s Gather Podcast. I’m your host Zeke in this episode. I have my friend Hamed to talk about the current state of technology and some more anime talk. You can follow his instagram Chef.Ockmed and his Facebook at Issa Doumbia. To see more of his life I like to give a content warning for any strong language used in this episode. I hope you have a nice day and enjoy the show.
Zeke: What would your origin story be?
Hamed: My origin story? That’s a really good question. Because the reason why that’s a hard question for me is like, my childhood has been not the best. But I would say my origin story would be no like somebody who’s just been going through life. Always been told to succeed. If you go to college, if you go to school, everything is going to be laid out in front of you. And that’s a damn that’s the biggest lie in America. People will people were born to immigrants and stories you come here, do well in school. You’re gonna do good in life and it’s it’s difficult because at the same time as the is the people that You know, when you come in, like networking, making sure that you know the right people who can give you a job or who can get you somewhere, that’s going to give you the best tools who really succeed. That’s where our parents failed to tell us. And so I had to learn that the hard way. And I’m just going to life do that difficult stage. But I feel like, the more difficult Your life is, and like, things aren’t as easy to give. That’s where you get more of a story. Yeah. And so if you do decide to have children or if you adopt or, you know, you decide whatever you decide to live your life, you have that type of experience to tell people, we like Yoast, not just what you learn in school. That’s why we like five to 10% it’s the people you know. And so luckily, I had Damali, Director of Student Life, she hooked me up to The job and like that was the first step and I’m like some people don’t even aren’t even employed. I had a high school friend. She just told me that she was unemployed for a whole year before she found a job. And she was just applying hold on indeed. And so it’s different story for many people, but why would you suddenly just be a struggling student? Well graduate? I’m looking for…
Zeke: Someone hire me.
Hamed: I need help. that’s my story.
Zeke: What medium, would you be like a movie a comic book?
Hamed: Uh huh. I think a movie because I feel like movies are like, the easiest art form for people to consume. And so like, you just have to tell an interesting story. And so I love superhero movies and like comic books you got to read. Some people find that to be So much work. And so movies and just usage as down, eat some popcorn at whatever. And you give like an hour and a half or two hours of your time and then you either like the movie, you don’t like the movie. So the only thing that you give to a movie is your time. And so, for me, I feel like because I’m planning on doing skits, so you might see me on YouTube, but I’m planning on doing skits and like for me at the end, like it’s like playing a different character. And so I love even for myself to maybe do movie have like more hardships. And so that’s a way to connect to like the young people. And so I know like the internet is all about jokes and means by like the areas where people get a bit serious about the real stuff. You know, everybody can relate to the unsellable. He has all by himself. Yeah, exactly. He played his dad like that was Something that I was like, yo, that’s really cool. And it’s also a way to like, get your creative juices going, you know, and so don’t just be about like the data in the math, even if you can be creative with data and math and like, the hard numbers and details and Excel. It’s also important for you, like maybe enjoy nature, like do something that isn’t really strict on the information that’s given. Yeah, how about you create that information and you find a way to express it? No such thing you do.
Zeke: Chadwick Boseman is going to play you.
Hamed: Exactly. Chadwick Boseman. You know, he plays mad historic character, historic character that he plays or like a regular dude, he plays. We add ChadwickBoseman that’s a great idea. Yeah,
Zeke: Shoot your shot.
Hamed: Definitely.
Zeke: So, in college years you want to do tech, decide not to do tech. I got a zero on my midterm. And decided not to do tech, but you still want to do it. So.
Hamed: So, tech is because I built my own gaming computer. And so I worked to help with Rodolfo, I’m not going to lie. But it was exhilarating. Like, people just think computers are this like, genius level. I mean, it is genius level, but that’s more like the coding and like making the computer actually do thing. But you can build your own machine. And that’s just putting parts together. And when you can do that, you just feel like another level. Like he just transcended you. I’ve built something that I can use, and you become attached to that. And so technology is more than just this wave of like, different machines and different like I know machines are way smarter than us but For us, you have to realize that we created those machines. And so tech is just, it’s just accelerating us probably going to be the next step in human evolution, we’ll find a way to blend technology with the human body before then. You just have to have something in technology that you can hold up and be rabid because it’s not, don’t see technology as like another area. In life or another industry. Technology is becoming intertwined with daily stuff, daily things that we do. And so the more that we learn about it, the more that we can also secure ourselves because you know, these companies, they like to take our information. And so if you know about, you know how to secure yourself, you know, the right questions to ask, and you just know how to put your foot down. Well, no, I don’t want that to happen. Because Because that’s the main reason why technology companies are taking advantage of us. Because we don’t know. Yeah. And so I’m not trying to be a fucking chicken. I’m trying to be one of the like, the Wall Street. And so it’s basically that drives my passion. But at the same time, I try to make sure that I’m also doing something creative to balance things out. Yeah.
Zeke: So what age did you build your computer?
Hamed: Built it when I was either 20 or 21 because I built it. I don’t know if it was the year 2017 year 2018. But it was a summer. And so I was like, yo, is time. I did research I want to new egg. New egg is basically anything with computers, you go there and you do your research. Like there are a lot of self help videos on YouTube.
Zeke: Youtube University.
Hamed: Yeah. Wait is that actually thing now.
Zeke: I know a lot of old people.
Hamed: Because like, YouTube should be a university like you should get a degree. Because there’s so many like self help and how to do things. And so for me, it’s just going into YouTube do my research and yet I built in I was like yo, rukh got pretty difficult. So I was like, What is another way I can get into technology without dealing with Baruch. And I found the program Empower. And so Empower is more than just an IT program. It’s a nonprofit, that helps people get professional as well. And so they also teach you the fundamentals of it. And if you want to get into cybersecurity, if you want to get into Cloud computing, if you want to get into coding, they have classes and it’s free. And if you get into like the the quality or graduate programs you have to start with like the fundamentals. They also give you a stipend. And so cybersecurity. I know a lot of people want to get into that. But I personally want to get into like networking. Know the switches and routers, how to build a network for a company. And then in the future, I want to get into Cloud computing. Because that’s the next week. Like our game. Yeah, love gaming. Exactly. There’s a program called shadow, where people don’t even need to build a gaming computer anymore. You just pay a monthly service and you have access to a computer. That’s probably in like Nigeria,or some shit, and you can play games from your computer. You just need really good internet access. Yeah.
Zeke: So with tech, you talks about like um companies and then contact the next evolution. Do you think it’s a positive evolution like in the Jetsons or a negative like in the Terminator?
Hamed: Yeah, that is the question. I feel like everybody’s asking because Of course, technology is just technology is going to evolve. But it’s the people that control the products is what makes wood it’s going to determine whether it’s evil or whether it’s good. And so we just have duties as citizen as technological citizens, you have to keep an open eye on Open Era, because I don’t know if people are gonna remember was this thing called internet neutrality? That was a big thing in the back. I don’t know if you remember when they were good. Yeah, net neutrality. I said, internet. Bob put an extra word in. But net neutrality. That was really important because people were going to put a price tag on the access of using internet and the beauty of the engineers that is free access. Well, you have to pay. Yeah. It’s like the equalizer. Yeah, the equalizer and so people are building the Companies people will have their own voices. And if you put a price tag on that, and the services that they use, that’s going to restrict a lot of people’s businesses and ease of access because I can be low income, I can start an actual business I don’t have a store, but I can start a business from home and through the internet, I can market myself and move just paying an optimum online monthly fee. I can start on business so my products online and become a big corporation like that. But you just that’s just an example. And so for technology itself, it’s it’s almost like it’s the sword that you wield and whatever you fight for the good guys or bad guys, whatever you’re fighting for. It’s whatever you want your ideology do and be expressed as you can either be or you just got to make sure that Facebook is not abusing you. And that you don’t become terminated.
Zeke: So if that with Facebook in mind, do you think there went to far with technology in terms of social media? Or that we’re just now, we just now understanding what we have done?
Hamed: I feel like is the second point, we just now understand how Facebook took advantage of us. And I don’t think people realize this, but any corporation that’s offering you something for free, is not necessarily free. Isn’t because Facebook is free, doesn’t mean that they’re taking. They’re not taking anything from you. I’m pretty sure everybody knows this. They’re using your information. Mm hmm. And selling that to companies. So that’s why you’ve seen Well, I said, I need a gaming mouse and I see 12 different ads in my fucking phone about gaming. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Yes, like, do permissions as So you have to watch your cellular devices as well. Like, I don’t know if people you’ve seen the movie x makena. I never heard of it. Yeah, yeah. And so there was a CEO there. There’s a CEO that was in the movie who admitted that was a fictional movie. But he said that he turned on the world’s microphones and cameras, without notifying any of our users. And he was like, the people who manufactured the phones, had to admit that they were also doing it as well. So that’s why he didn’t get in trouble is because if he got in trouble, he would expose the own companies and he would have exposed all the other companies that were doing the same thing as well. And so, for me, it’s just like, you have to watch all the permissions your locations, which apps have permissions on your microphones and cameras to make sure that You’re secured. And the only way you know that you’re secured is that you get educated about technology in the first place. And so, for me, I feel like it’s not us who went too far. I just feel like companies got too greedy. And you know why they get greedy because of the money. And so if you put $1 sign on anything, companies will do their best to abuse that system, because all we care about is what their bottom eyelids are. And so they don’t care about our safety as like that because I’ve heard that Facebook does he even encrypt our passwords in our information, they just have it in like a WordPad document. And so, things like that. We just have to make sure that we’re minimizing the amount of information that we’re putting on these apps. And getting, you’re gonna have to start reading the terms and condition. You know about that. I don’t know. If you guys are like great coders, I’m actually like thinking maybe a billion, this should be an AI that helps you minimize all the information in terms of conditions and give you all of like the key points, okay? This is what we’re going to do with your information. This is what you should be looking out for. These are like the hidden fees. And so if you have that type of software that can better empower us because I know people don’t like to read, but Yo, there’ll be pages of that. But I think it’s most likely that a tactic used by companies, so they make sure that people don’t read it in the first place. So if there are any great coders out there, be sure to make me like your sponsor be like, Oh, I got this idea from him. You make an AI that can read terms and conditions. And that’s going to better empower us.
Zeke: Bout to cancel the episode real quick.
Hamed: Definitely, yo, yo, I feel like I gotta reach out to them. I know one code, but she’s just starting out no matter. Yeah, this is a great question.
Zeke: And with that do you think we should continue forward in tech and social media, or we should just cut back and wait to come back into our daily lives.
Hamed: I feel like at this point A lot of people it’s become like an addiction that we don’t even recognize. And so people who do are aware like their technology use some people just you know, go out for a walk or there’s some people turn off the phones and stuff like that. But um, it’s just up to us to realize that we have to know how much time social media is taken from daily lives. And for me, I know Like, it’s like second nature, like sometimes I catch myself, I could be working on something or applying for a job. I pick up my phone, unlock it, go to Facebook is right there. And like, I’d be swiping, but sometimes I’m catching myself now. And like I’m doing more as a habit. And so you just have to realize what you’re doing how much time these devils taking away from us and start to like, make time for other things. Maybe started drawing, maybe started doing something creative or going out riding a bike like
Zeke: Hanging out with friends.
Hamed: Yeah, definitely. And, you know, I know with our generation, especially, like the, I would say the young millennials and Generation Z was this. Um, we’re like a mixture some. Some websites say we’re like the the latest Millennials like the babies are like the latter half. Some say we’re like early Generation Z. You don’t have a late Yeah, we don’t have a label, like right in between. So we are we are the mixture. And so I know like going out and like with the political climate and maybe you’re not where you want to be in life, but like it’s you just have to find a little beauties in life. You know, I know like depression is being in our generation, being sad and being not having the energy to do things that are productive. And it’s just basically the way the boomers and the way they left our generation to fend for ourselves. Just the college degrees equivalent to a high school diploma now. Yeah. And so it’s no pension and yeah example. Go on case is you know, exactly and so the way that we live our lives, I know that difficult especially mentally and emotionally, but it’s just up to us to like start going and talk therapies or doing things that can better help ourselves. Because I know it’s hard and like the way they set this up, it’s difficult to find a job in the first place, don’t make it easy. And so for us to start living the lives that we want, and social media only representing the positive lives of people not representing the struggles that people go through. It’s difficult and I feel like social media can also be a good thing because the rise of podcasts you start seeing people talk about like real things. And so I listened to the Love Hour I don’t know if you know Kevin was saying oh my god I listened to him his podcast Oh boy. Yeah, right. Just you you pay you pay to Patreon. Is I recommend that if you have like, if because it’s like $5 a month? Yeah. So if you have the money like definitely, there are people who, you know, realize that life is just not about social media and like, be living your best life. We know that we there’s mental health is becoming big as well. And like, people are just becoming connected, you know, there can be trolls, they can be people who just want to talk about political things all the time, and we just need spaces like this great job. The way I want to start doing my skins is to talk about real life stuff as well. And so eventually probably do a podcast. And we can be brothers in that as well. Hello. Definitely started it you trailblazing? Like we’re definitely going to look back on Zeke did it? I can do a two. Yeah. And so it’s definitely social media can have its positives and its negatives. Like with all things.
Zeke: With that in mind, do you think automation is a good thing to continue this? I know we’ve always, there’s always done that with like automation cottengin. Yeah, right. Computers a form of automation,
Hamed: Automation. Because now we’ve reached like the next level automation. And that’s artificial intelligence. And so it’s a dangerous thing to play with. I mean, the vision that like Elon Musk and like, the people who hold these technologies, companies like AI can do a lot of things, especially with Elon Musk. I like the way certain architecture is, I don’t know. ocher architects are planning to do like smart cities as well. It’s beautiful. Like, yeah, the concept of having like fully automated cars, where it’s like, robots, like you can have no traffic because they’re basically meaning they’re all on the system. But the negative thing is that some people out there, you know, blackhat people who just want to fuck up the whole system. And the thing is security will always be the issue. Yeah, with technology. Hacking will always be the villain, obviously, like technology in general. And so playing a role in that, but like, let me further Elon Musk. So just imagine a world a smart city where every car is automated, that means like, you can order a car and it comes to you, you can go into it right? And it just drives out it automatically like, like 50 miles per hour. But this is like in a city he knows wants to stop wanting to go. And most of these cars can like run on a system and it almost looks like just like light rails just knowing when to stop knowing when to go. That means We won’t have really a need for sidewalks because we like redline areas like different areas we can tell the cars where not to go when to stop, we can have sidewalks be intertwined with the way the car the automated cars are gone we can have cities that probably have lighter panels, knowing where to go and that can like be a visual transformation but also like a safety transformation. And so it’s just beautiful like the way like AI can make our capable capabilities are that can reduce our carbon footprint. We can focus on other things we can build like smart buildings that have solar panels or they can have bio engineered plants on the top that provide electricity and stuff like that. So yeah, I can definitely initiate like another level of, you know, I would say advancement for you midlife. And so it’s difficult to say that automation is the death of everything. Well, there are some jobs that will disappear, you have automation, but at the same time, the thing with automation that we have above is creativity and emotion. If people begin to like code that in like to like the How to be genuinely if emotion and creativity, maybe that’s what we have a problem with. But right now the beauty of beauty human versus technologies that we have creativity, the right the way to be creative and aspect. You know, there are ways like, is he going to show me You can call our noun away? Yeah, it’s probably like, yeah, you can process it. And so that’s a dangerous thing, but the beauty is that we can Grasp things in a more emotional level.
Zeke: With that in mind, in myanimation class in the professor talked about an artist she knew, he had a style of painting. Yeah, And someone was able to code it.
Hamed: In his style, you can make things in his style. Yeah. Okay. I mean, that’s dangerous. But in, in a way, it’s just we have to figure out a way to like who work with AI or like, we have to determine that with our advancement in society. Either we become the creators of AI, and like, basically automate everything, or we create like a law or a technology in a way that we don’t influence these. We don’t make emotion and creativity automated because then we What stops AI from controlling us? And so I’m pretty sure that there’s a law of robotics or law of technology that we have to follow…
Zeke: Three laws of robots.
Hamed: Yeah, something like that. Yeah. And so, with that in mind is just what we choose to do that can really determine our future. Yeah. I mean, that’s just my perspective.
Zeke: These are questions, we have the answer.
Hamed: Exactly. We’re next. We’re like, I feel like, because technology’s just great to be born now. And people want to have children like what the hell are they gonna do? Like what swim bro? I don’t even know. Like I fear. I’m pretty nervous about like, if we decide to have kids, what do allies would look like? Yes, it is looking. I don’t know and things have to change.
Zeke: This isn’t working “exactly this is in between it can go either way. We all don’t know which one. We don’t like it’s 50 50 right now if the fish The other thing good.
Hamed: Yeah, I don’t think we’re in good hands at all, but it is up to us to like lead the charge.
Zeke: So I like people who started out making like the whole idea that Mars had water on it because we was there first and then mess it up. And then we sent Adam and Eve. And then they killed the dinosaurs and repopulated the Earth.
Hamed: Who thought of this, conspiracy theories. So Adam and Eve were actually astronauts. Yeah, damn, bro. Thats, I’m actually going to look that up after I’ve never heard it.
Zeke: Yeah like there was water on Mars. And everything because we were there first and then we just messed it up.
Hamed: Wouldn’t there be like other things that are Mars like signs of life maybe like somebody left like a comic book lying that never decayed. But just water. Yeah, I mean, when I see that is interesting. Yeah.
Zeke: And with animation and theres a lot of creative, I feel theres a creative boom right now. That probably like in history there was another Renaissance. Yeah, there is the rise of podcast and everything. And everyone is like I want to create.
Hamed: Yeah. Push that um. I see that there is a creative boom. But I think with podcast is just yeah evolution and aware that people are getting their voices out there realizing that there’s an audience for that. Yeah. And so which podcasts is just another way it’s almost like thought therapy instead of listen to music. Some people just like listening to other people’s talk. Sometimes I literally doesn’t a part of my morning routine like I can have Righteous and Ratchet in the background is cracking jokes or talking about stuff that are happening in the internet. And like talking about their lives, and maybe they’re promoting something that opens my eyes. And so, for me, like podcasts, play more in my phone than music. And in a way, it’s almost like connecting with people without really having without really being there because I know, having to go out especially for us introverts. That’s exactly the energy as well. But since podcasts are more like a one sided conversation and you’re like an audience, you can basically decide whether or not you relate to it. You can if it’s on YouTube, you can leave a comment and stuff like that. But with things like that, it’s I feel like it’s important for us to have the Just music but also people just talking about life in general. feel like that’s also important and people are realizing, you know, people really like listening to us. And so yeah, like people just see that as a way as a way of creation. And I also see that so says not a lot of people are talented doesn’t take a lot of talent to be a great podcast, you just have to talk about something interesting and be energetic. You’re good, though. You’re good. I use that to act. Sometimes it’s good questions as well. So the more people see that and witness that it provides a way of like, power to the people. And so the more people feel empowered to do things, the more they get themselves, try something new.
Zeke: But one second
Hamed: Yeah no problem.
Zeke: I just click the button. Yeah, okay. Cool. Cuz I know
Hamed: You gotta make sure. You know, I’m just talking to a black screen over there pretty is definitely a thing where I see people are deciding now that they should start on things like Tyler Perry and his studio that he just built, like people are starting to own things in their own, because they realize that there’s power in that now I feel like the more people become smart and aware of that ownership is key. They have the power to negotiate. Like say for instance, if you make a show on your own, that reduces the risk older shows like oh, we can just franchise this and just show the pay them and then show the show on our channel. And so there’s different things like that. That’s really important. Yeah, and I feel like since people are now empowered to create a way to make money Yes, definitely gonna see a lot of content. Renaissance 2.0 Yeah, and those 2.0 I feel like it’s the whole world this time instead of just in the, in all the European countries, there’s just the whole world and it’s powerful, like people just are making own documentaries, maybe exposing light on things that we’ve never seen before. And so I feel like yeah, it’s a way to another way to connect people. Mm hmm.
Zeke: What misconceptions about technology that people have?
Hamed: One great misconception that I see is that technology will be the death of everybody. And that people will just think technology is here to just take jobs and people are here to take advantage of us. I feel like it’s worth the quote, like, the rich get richer and the poor get poorer, you know, the rich get richer and the poor make them richer. We allow ourselves to become taken advantage of, the more that we learn about technology. And the more that we empower ourselves to learn about what these companies are doing to take advantage of us. That’s when we can decide to step up and say, no, maybe not support this company anymore. Let me create my own type of social media. I don’t know if this was known. But are you familiar with Jeffrey or moto? Yeah. Before it was like a while back, I think, two or three years ago, he was actually promoting a social media platform that was like Facebook. Well, the catch was, is that for your information, they actually paid you. And so it was almost like a company that had its employees have stake in it. And so I don’t know why. I happen to have to do my research, I forgot the name of this social media platform. But he was promoting it. I don’t think it really lifted off. Because some people probably was just too costly to like us to manage. And so the the business plan was like, the more people you invite, the more of a bigger payout you have. And so that was a way to like, get people into it and stuff like that. So it was almost like a pyramid scheme. Yeah. Because I think that’s what made it peep. People not believe in it too much. And so things like that. I’m pretty sure you just have to appeal to the younger generation when it comes to things. Because we’re so impressionable. We’re so fascinated with like, new apps and new things that make our lives either more important or make our lives easier in a way. So with the rise of Snapchat, if there was a social media platform that can, you know, benefit the people instead of taking advantage of that, that could probably become past popular. But people don’t know enough to know that they probably need something like that. Yes. And they just want something that’s free, and something that doesn’t have too complicated. And so that’s how that’s one misconception I see that is really important. And people have to start quickly changing their minds because the more they believe that way, the more they’re going to push themselves back and you’re not going to grow and the people that realize that are going to grow and lead them and it does. So I’m telling you this now you got to step up.
Zeke: You heard it here first.
Hamed: Yeah, definitely
Zeke: Is so, we talked earlier about your path for tech right… [Rambling] What’s your next step in tech actually?
Hamed: My next step. UM my next step in tech. My next tech is step wow, is actually it’s one thing to learn about technology. But it’s another thing to be a continuous student. Because technology will always evolve, evolve. And it’s important to know that you are making sure that you know, you stay on top of the news, make sure that viruses they’re always evolving as well. There’s viruses that people research with all the malware, because viruses are blocked because the malware software knows that okay, this is a virus Stop it. But viruses always being made. And so if there’s not a virus in a file of like, murders, antivirus or Kaspersky, or McAfee, if that software doesn’t know, the coding of the virus, it can let it pass. It can be invisible. And so there’s viruses that are continuously evolving. And so with that in mind, technology has to continue to evolve. And with that in mind, as well, security has to continue to evolve. And with that evolution process, if you don’t take the step to do your research, and to be like, okay, maybe I don’t see it in my new feature, future, but I do see it as an important thing. definitely take your time to research drawing programs that are free, that basically teach you about the different things that technology is about because you are using them. You are a stakeholder in the world that we live in now. And so the fact that you use it and you don’t know about it, that is something that can be taken advantage of people can take advantage of that. Next thing, you know, you’re being sold for $100 on the dark web. And so it’s the it’s more of like, we have to step up. Because these companies are continuing to push forward, they’re continue going to do what they need to do in order to meet their bottom line. People who wanted to short people’s lives online, they’re continuing to do because they’re probably being paid to do that. And so not a lot of people are looking out for us. So we have to take that step to look out.
Zeke: And I see the similarities to like bio now how like the body have to keep evolved in exactly because to fight off diseases and bacteria,
Hamed: Definitely.
Zeke: And then how technology has to keep evolving to fight viruses.
Hamed: Definitely if you see technology as a person, that person is just balls on a quicker space than us. But technology is same thing as a human being, it needs to be protected. It has like a lot of whatcha ma call it vulnerabilities that can be exploited. So as the human body, it can be destroyed really quickly, if somebody knows the right thing to do, or like if you went into your phone and you deleted all the coding as you just made your phone die, you can never fix that back up, you have to buy a new one. And so like human beings, we need to be protected. We need to go to the doctor and make sure that we’re good. And so these devices relate to us and so much, but we have classes in school that teach us about the human body, not another classes that teaches about technology and how to use it and how to protect yourself and so on. It’s time for everybody to step up, we have to make technology a part of the curriculum, because it’s a new idea in a brand new. I would say component to human life, I would say. So a lot of people don’t really believe in it as a practice or as like, a way to be taught. And so it’s just we have to change that mindset.
Zeke: That brings Episode 5.1 to a close. You can listen to Episode 5.2 Nerds and Anime this Friday, February 28th. I hope you have a nice day and hope to see you there.
[Music]